First, let me start by saying this might get deleted; I really hope it doesn't, but it might. For the first time ever since I have been a Flirt4Free member I have been made mad! Who made me mad? No, it wasn't Flirt4Free (you guys are pretty great), it wasn't a model (I love you all), it wasn't another member (hi to all of you), it was a Studio!

I was in the room of a new model and as soon as I arrive I see that a gray is giving her fake tips and she believes them to be real. I thought this model was very atttractive so I told her about fake tips and what real tips look like. I really liked her so I stayed for an hour and continued to inform her on other subjects she asked me about such as privates, whispering, tips, group chats, power boobst and private chats.

Now something has happened I have never seen before. Someone from her Studio pops up saying I am lying to this model about what I am saying! I have never once lied to a model and pride myself in my personal life of being a very honest person! The Studio told me I was lying to the new model by telling her that most models I have seen flash their boobs for 50 credits. They, also, said that I was lying when I said that most models set group chats for 10 minutes long if they receive 500 credits. The Studio continued to inform me that they knew the truth because they were the Studio for 75% of the models on Flirt4Free. I told the Studio that they were ignorant for not informing their models of such basic things as fake tips and leaving it up to honest members to try to help them and tell them the truth. At this point I was kicked out of the room by the Studio!

I have been a member here for two years and have always been respectful of every model. If I see a new model getting taken advantage of I do the right thing and help. If this Studio is truly as big as they claim then they should quit being so ignorant and sending their models out live on cam with no basic information! Show some respect for your models and give them the basic tools they need to successfully do their job!

I will return to this models room in 24 hours when I am no longer banned. I will continue to answer any questions she asks. I will continue to help her because her Studio is too ignorant to!

Thank you for reading my rant. I hope this doesn't get deleted. Please, if you see new models being taken advantage of then help them. Quote

1. mmmmmmm bbq'd studio.
2. "Persistance is its own reward."
3. don Quixote eventually gets trashed by the windmill.

#just sayin Quote

You should always take screenshots of events that you think are not right and pass them on to the the site admin.

http://www.flirt4free.com/support.php


and email all screenshots to this address

CustomerService@vs.com



As i'm guessing you don't have any screenshots, what I would do is email the email address above stating the room name, the screenname you was using, the time and date this event took place. The not so smart studio that seems to run 75% of the sites rooms (rolls eyes here) should be aware that all the chat in every room is logged at all times (even in private, group chat, party chat) and the site admin can easily go back and see what happened.


So email them with these details so they can look into this matter mate. It does sound fishy to me that the studio is behaving in this manner. Also studio could be just a performer or anyone with a studio login and does not mean it was a real studio manager at the time.


Also regarding the topic of having to explain such basic things like what is a real tip looks like and how private, party chat and group chat works seems to get missed by a lot of studios recently and I find as you do that I have to explain how the site works to new performers and the worst part how to use the group chat and set a credit amount that is in the "reality zone", seen some models come on here new and set things like 2000 credits for a 5 min show.. Seriously ? and then they wonder why they don't get shows. I also know why some performers set things like 2000 credits because some studios don't tell them what the real value of a credit is and when some performers are told what 100 credits = in $ they are shocked, so studios don't lie to performers about the credit rates and explain that to the performers or it just makes you look bad too and explain that as a business of course the performers get a percentage of the credits, the site gets a % and the studio a %. There is nothing wrong explaining how a business works to make an income to performers, but telling them lies regarding the real dollar $ value of a credit is very low in my opinion and in time it comes out you lied to them because as you see customers, other performers and even the site admin will explain to performers such things.


My thinking goes like this a standard rate group chat for 5 mins show should be "300-400" credits and 10 min show for "600-800" on a normal day and of course on slow days set it lower if you want shows. Only very few models on here can ask for over "1000" credits for a 10 minute show that will actually hit the limit to allow the show to start.


I think the best advice is to tell models to go watch other rooms for a while and watch the good performers that seem to have many registered members in their room chatting and actually spending credits. This way you will find reality kicks in very quickly for these performers and they may even realise the people that hired them(the studios) told them a few pork pies related to how this site works and what sort of pay they will see. The truth is yes it is a good way to make a good income quickly "IF" you perform well and have the attitude to work on such a site, but if you didn't realise how the site works and not willing to work in this manner it turns into a total time waste and better off working in a fast food place, so if you think as a new performer laying around and not performing and your looks are going to make the guys/girls jump up and down for you and throw credits at you, you are sadly wrong... I have been here many years and have seen some amazing looking girls here in the past and now that will either not last or have gone due to their lack of performing here and even a simple thing like chatting to people in their rooms. I see some new performers all the time with this phrase "I don't chat in free chat ... want to chat to me click private"... When I see that my 2-4 weeks countdown starts for that performer and in 99.99% of cases them performers are gone by 2-4 weeks because they make zero credits or very low amount fo credits that they can't even live of and fall very low in the performer rating system and finally asked to find a new job or site. Also this studio person in your case all he/she did was make the performer look bad and any members that were there thought "NEXT ROOM !" and avoid this one in the future.. So Studio people use some common sense when you login as studio and talk to members.



Also I get asked this a lot so i'm going to just add it here, this is what we pay for credits as a customer.


250 Credits for $27.99
500 Credits for $49.99
1,000 Credits for $99.99
1,500 Credits for $149.99

Also sometimes there are some deals the site gives members where we get some free credits on top of our purchases, but the value as you see is really 10 credits = $1 USD.


Best regards


Nabil
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Nabil darling, since you are sharing so much of yourself and your options about pricing ranges for the horrifying, yet still an improvement over party chat, Group Shows, you should also inform the crowd about the percentage of those HUGE amounts that the models receive. (LAUGH)

#just sayin'

but since we are all playing in the "price range" game let me offer my somewhat (tilted) view...

5 minute (group.grope) 1000 credits
10 minute (circle.jerk) 2500 credits

anything more than that just (jack) it until the 'players' are selling homes, trailers, entire apartment blocks to equal the experience yielded the performer.

(pulls) Nabil's (hair) and (kisses) his (bruised.lips) Quote

(pulls) Nabil's (hair) and (kisses) his (bruised.lips)



Meaow ..


You know what I mean Amanda and understand the problem of group chat and party chat as I do. Just it seems the floating rate for a 5 minute group chat show is 300 credits which sadly is the same rate for a 5 minute private show at the standard rate of 60CPM.


I do think 5 minute group chat shows should be limited to 500 credits minimum by the site so therefore teaches the customers that is the minimum rate and also stops the performers being taken advantage of.


I have seen models set it as low as 200 credits for a 5 minute group show which I think is a bad joke and sadly even when set to that I realised the models doing that were still not getting a group chat show. So it's a fine line really what the group chat is worth and really depends on the performer.


BUT I do think they need to limit it to 500 credits for a 5 minute group chat show minimum and any other time above 5 minutes can be set no lower then 500 credits for a group show for 5 minutes.


The problem when allowing performers to have access to rate changes is customers always find ways to abuse it and take advantage of the performers. Limits by the site stop this behaviour I am seeing. I'm not knocking group chat or party chat I think they are both great products and deserve a place on the site.


Regards

Nabil Quote

Thank You for the intel !!!!





Quote

Meaow ..


You know what I mean Amanda and understand the problem of group chat and party chat as I do. Just it seems the floating rate for a 5 minute group chat show is 300 credits which sadly is the same rate for a 5 minute private show at the standard rate of 60CPM.


I do think 5 minute group chat shows should be limited to 500 credits minimum by the site so therefore teaches the customers that is the minimum rate and also stops the performers being taken advantage of.


I have seen models set it as low as 200 credits for a 5 minute group show which I think is a bad joke and sadly even when set to that I realised the models doing that were still not getting a group chat show. So it's a fine line really what the group chat is worth and really depends on the performer.


BUT I do think they need to limit it to 500 credits for a 5 minute group chat show minimum and any other time above 5 minutes can be set no lower then 500 credits for a group show for 5 minutes.


The problem when allowing performers to have access to rate changes is customers always find ways to abuse it and take advantage of the performers. Limits by the site stop this behaviour I am seeing. I'm not knocking group chat or party chat I think they are both great products and deserve a place on the site.


Regards

Nabil



i know my baby, i was getting my anger out at the product not the poster *sigh*

And OP.. i agree entirely with your rant... the studios are *REMOVED BY ADMINISTRATOR* all of them... I've taken on a couple, one recently... luckily I had a couple advantages over most posters who complain about their 'studied indifference' to properly training and advising their models. *sigh* It's funny though, ten years ago I had all of these arguments with a 'muckity muck' on another venue, and he told me flat out then "Things are changing and you are not going to like how."

3. don Quixote gets trashed by windmills

became the rule of it all.

So keep up your ranting, you are always welcome in my threads.



(kisses) Quote

This is why I want all rooms to contain an identifying studio symbol. Buried somewhere in the bio page. No geographic or other sensitive info, but something to let us know whom we are dealing through.
Should I decide to renew vip membership, I can then put all models from the right studios as favorites.
If the site still has a quasi-game like mentality, why can't the silly competitiveness be among the studios instead of pitting a speudo unpublic stat game member against members. That is too personal. But it seems some studios want to play deadly games with us. Take away the personal part of the games, that they flirt doesn't even have the guts to publish, and let the game be about the studios. It then has the alure of a team sport, not a self defeating vindictive personal one.
They enjoyed playing with us, let them play themselves if they think it is such a great idea. Quote

This is why I want all rooms to contain an identifying studio symbol. Buried somewhere in the bio page. No geographic or other sensitive info, but something to let us know whom we are dealing through.
Should I decide to renew vip membership, I can then put all models from the right studios as favorites.
If the site still has a quasi-game like mentality, why can't the silly competitiveness be among the studios instead of pitting a speudo unpublic stat game member against members. That is too personal. But it seems some studios want to play deadly games with us. Take away the personal part of the games, that they flirt doesn't even have the guts to publish, and let the game be about the studios. It then has the alure of a team sport, not a self defeating vindictive personal one.
They enjoyed playing with us, let them play themselves if they think it is such a great idea.


Sometimes it's not always the studios. Sometimes it's the actresses themselves who are playing deadly manipulating games with the members. Quote

Actresses?
Did you get your tv and your computer confused again cfk??? Quote

Sometimes it's not always the studios. Sometimes it's the actresses themselves who are playing deadly manipulating games with the members.



I rather like that statement.
It would imply that, to you, we are more than people flashing body parts.
It would also imply that you see performers as capable of thought processes required for such manipulation...

*Big Kiss*
Love it!
I'm rather new here;
but enjoying these posts greatly!

Oh, and I'm the only one chose (pushed) to be here from my studio
I'm on my own
So intel is greatly appreciated!




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OMG:

...you see performers as capable of thought processes required for such manipulation...


It's been the name of the game long before Al Gore created the internet
Quote

I rather like that statement.
It would imply that, to you, we are more than people flashing body parts.
It would also imply that you see performers as capable of thought processes required for such manipulation...

*Big Kiss*
Love it!

...

but we've gotten loads of good intel from these posts
VS, guests,
and a few great Performers.
Makes it nicer to to perform here.

Again
TY


LOL ohhhhh and the underlying between the lines of it all ... (YUM) a diagnostician's playground
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LOL ohhhhh and the underlying between the lines of it all ... (YUM) a diagnostician's playground




Thought it was spelled out quite clearly
but here:

If I wanted to flash tits and show ass
I could go anywhere
I LOVE that this is more stimulating
and people actually want a performance

As for the Performer against Performer
or Studio against Studio
Performer and Studio against Member
Member against Member...

I'm sure it happens less due to these forums
Or at least is easier to avoid
Thanks to the people who take the time to help out where they can




Quote

Actresses?
Did you get your tv and your computer confused again cfk???


I'm never confused by machines, just people. Confusion mainly depends on other people's actions and attitudes. Quote

Thought it was spelled out quite clearly
but here:

If I wanted to flash tits and show ass
I could go anywhere
I LOVE that this is more stimulating
and people actually want a performance

As for the Performer against Performer
or Studio against Studio
Performer and Studio against Member
Member against Member...

I'm sure it happens less due to these forums
Or at least is easier to avoid
Thanks to the people who take the time to help out where they can




oh what YOU were saying was quite clear darling ... i was simply noting how much is said when unsaid ... *shrug* make of that what you will. (kisses)
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oh what YOU were saying was quite clear darling ... i was simply noting how much is said when unsaid ... *shrug* make of that what you will. (kisses)



Oh Thank You!
I'd have worried if I started to be anything but blatant!
I'm afraid that after years in my field of choice
My synapses love to jump the gaps!
Wholly enjoyed;
though I'm glad to let others be the ones to craft Delicious Riddles!

I've a friend who wanted to see this thread.
I thought it might do her good to notice
that other people hold her opinion.
That is important to some people.

I'd LOVE to see the studio affiliation on the performer's Bio as well !!!!

*Bounces off to be Wicked and Kinky* Quote

ha Quote

Thanks for the info on this thread...

RE: OP...... I am lucky that I have a rockin studio- however, I was told of more basic things by my first "clients"... Like "dude, that is a fake tip.. leave her alone"....

Every system is different, and I guess I can see how a studio could be signed up with more than one network and not really know each networks process and set-up... That is the fault of the studio, just sign girls up, place them and collect... It seems sleazy and tacky.

I hate arrogance and ignorance (when you should know better) more than anything.

Sad for that new model! Thankful for someone like you who does TRY to help!



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Its refreshing to see all this optimism in the forums. Glass half full kind of mentality, my kind of thinking. I hope everyone is having a good time over the holiday season. I've done some quality time with the fam, drinking wine and eating pie etc. I haven't been on the forum in a while, but enjoying reading the posts today with all the good vibes. I know my typing isn't the greatest, my sincere apologies to anyone I've offended wif my badd key pressin skillz.

Yes, models come and go, so appreciate your faves when they are here. Hopefully they are out living life to the fullest, . I hope everyone is having a great 2012 so far. Special thanks to PUrg for that insightful post. There are some good peeps around here, you guys are alot of fun.

And to you glass half empty scrooges (insert negative comment here)
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